◆◆PES2013--Jon Murphy采访（EA&授权&未来）

小卜

来源：
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-06-14-pes-hits-back-konami-accuses-fifa-of-copying-reveals-truth-behind-licenses-and-explains-seabass-new-role

翻译版可看：

http://bbs.winning11cn.com/viewthread.php?tid=1067706

PES hits back: Konami accuses FIFA of copying, reveals truth behind licenses and explains Seabass' new role

KONAMI指责FIFA抄袭PES、授权背后的真相、高冢新吾现在的新角色

（英语水平有限，文章内容暂不细细翻译了，有兴趣的借助翻译工具粗略理解一下）
期待论坛里的评论帝、翻译帝:bz1:
Jon Murphy has had enough. I can see it in his face as we sit down for our interview in Konami UK's Chiswick offices. And I can feel it in every answer he delivers to all the questions I put to him.

Perhaps it's not surprising. The Konami veteran has spent years as Pro Evolution Soccer European team leader banging the PES drum, but the last few have, by his own admission, been the most galling. As EA's FIFA series has pulled away from PES - the game so many of us played religiously "back in the day" before turning to the dark side at the beginning of this generation - he's had to accept second place. A distant second place. And doesn't everyone know it.

Still, the frankness with which he discusses PES' problems surprises me. During our chat Murphy explains Shingo 'Seabass' Takatsuka's shock exit from the console PES team, accuses FIFA of copying, alleges EA locks out Konami from licenses and delivers some home truths to fans of the football video game genre who, he believes, need their heads banging together.

Fair play, I say. For too long the enigmatic Japanese company has shied away from tackling the problems its once all-conquering football franchise has suffered from in recent times. As PES 2013 - a game that may match FIFA in terms of quality - nears release, the next-generation looms and series overlord Seabass is finally off doing something else, perhaps some aggression is just what we need.

（1）I've heard good things about the game this year (see Martin's PES 2013 preview), and now I've played it I can see why. But I know what our readers will say: I've heard that before, why should I believe PES is better now? You must see this reaction. How does that impact on the work you do?

Jon Murphy: It does have a lot of impact particularly on what I do, because my job is to try and get the team to have a deeper connection with fans and obviously that's not always easy because they're over in Japan and a lot of them don't speak English. So there's a lot of filtering that has to be done on that process.

I understand where the fans are coming from, because in past years we have talked about going down a certain direction and I don't think we've gone far enough down that direction. I don't think it's necessarily that we've not done what we've said. It's that we haven't taken it far enough in the past. The reason this game feel like it plays differently is because the things we've concentrated on we are pushing to the logical conclusion rather than holding back.

The reason for that is to do with the setup of the team now. The organisation within the team has changed. We've got new producers coming through. We've got a new guy called Kei [Masuda]. It's not just him - there are other key people in other positions. The team structures have changed and the way they work together has changed.

At the moment we're seeing finally trust in our plans, and full conviction with what we want to see through. In the past, a good example is the manual passing system we brought about several years ago, but we never took it to the stage where it was really completely hands off. This new team is now willing to take those risks.

（2）What sparked this structural reorganisation?

Jon Murphy: I wouldn't say sparked is the right way of describing it because it's been so gradual. It's been the struggle we've had on this generation. It's been the releasing of a couple of products, realising where we were going wasn't where the team wanted to be going, but at the same time certain people within the team had been there for a long time perhaps, didn't really know how to force it in a new direction.

At the same time there have been changes in upper management as well. There have been company changes that have been made where, as a Japanese company we see dealing directly with the consumer as key to the development of products. There have been all kinds of forces at work.

From my side, I've been trying to open a door for consumers for some time. That's been a gradual process as well. All these things have come together this year to the point where we feel like we're back on a route we're happy with. If you talk to the team it's a route we will then continue into the future. The product this year, there are key focuses within that product they intent to push out into future years with future versions using different engines.

（3）For the first time Seabass is no longer the face of PES. Why is that?

Jon Murphy: Because we wanted to have a certain amount of shake-up in the team to get new blood through, and also because we've got him on new projects that aren't directly related to the PES franchise as you would see it as the traditional model. Obviously there's a lot of time and space left for a video game of the like of PES as you would understand it, but we can't sit around thinking just as video games now. Someone's got to be thinking about new projects. So he's filling that role. At the same time it gives us a chance to blood some new kids and force some new directions.

（4）Was the decision to remove Seabass from PES made in part because of a degree of dissatisfaction with previous PES games that perhaps didn't go far enough?

Jon Murphy: You have to think these things play a part in the decisions we've made. It's not just things like that. Seabass himself had got to a point where he was perhaps getting a bit frustrated as to how he would take the franchise on. He was right there at the start of development of PES. He was the creator of PES so to speak. His vision of football games hadn't developed as fast as the machines that could run football games. He had a more traditional view of video games rather than a modern view of video games, which is to do with the sandboxing of games and the rewards that can be offered by that.

We've seen in Japan, it's fair to say, for a long time a tradition of storytelling with a video game. Whereas in America or Europe we've seen a more freestyle approach - at least it gives the impression of freestyle. Obviously a sandbox game isn't a sandbox game - you're still being led by the hand, but that impression was different between the two cultures.

There are lots of reasons for him stepping over. He's not stepping down from the team. Day to day he's still involved in everything they're doing. He's within the production team for all PES-related items. He's still in the same office. He's still sat alongside the same people. He's still walking around giving input. It's not that we've booted him out of Konami. He's been moved on to what could turn into potentially some very interesting ideas on where to take football.

（5）So he is still working on PES the brand?

Jon Murphy: He is still working on football for us, is probably the easiest way of thinking about it. Whether or not that's Winning Eleven or PES production stuff, or we've got a whole new IP, or a new system of delivering games, whatever it is, he's involved in our football studio still. As far as the short term goes that is PES anyway. So he's still there with PES. What that turns into later goodness only knows. But he's still there.

（6）How do you access PES' current health in the UK specifically but also in the wider context of Europe? How's it doing?

Jon Murphy: It's probably gone through a period of intensive care and is now showing full signs of recovery. It's had a massive shot of morphine in its arm, and it's just about to get out of bed and start fighting again.

（7）In the UK it feels like last year FIFA pulled away from PES, more so than in previous years.

Jon Murphy: You can talk about two things: the quality of the product and the sales of the product. In terms of the sales of the product, clearly EA has been pulling right away from us. To be fair, if you look directly at the UK, we've never had a lead on them. We've always had a product quality lead on them, but we've never overtaken them in sales. There's always been a sales gap. The sales gap has grown in the UK. That's obvious. It's partly due to the quality of the product, which we've been improving and now stacks up easily against FIFA with this version. But it's also to do with the money spent on marketing and the money spent to lock us out of licenses.

There's a certain amount of work they've done very well on PR to convince people that the gap is bigger than it actually is.
（8）What do you mean by that?


Jon Murphy: Opinion has turned against PES in a way that's been helped along that isn't necessarily born out by the quality of the product recently. There was a period of dissatisfaction with the product with good reason - several years - where we didn't know where we were going. But recently the quality of the product has come back, and I don't think we've been given proper respect for that because so many have bought into the idea that FIFA is better, just in the same way people bought into the idea PES was much better than FIFA in years gone by, and it took a while for them to get out of that situation because it was so ingrained. We're now seeing the opposite's true. There's an automatic assumption now that FIFA is just better.

For example, if you look at satisfaction with online experience, we get a lot of complaints from people saying they're not happy with the lag in PES, and that FIFA has perfect online play. We all know if you play FIFA online you have a whole series of problems. I'm not saying we're better online or they're better online, but the opinion swung around to put us under the microscope more than them these days. I also think we don't get enough recognition for the way we tend to innovate still and they do still tend to follow a lot of what we do.

（9）Can you give me any examples of that?

Jon Murphy: If you look further back into the past of PES you can see they've obviously gone from a game that was totally different from PES to one that started copying PES to one that started taking areas PES did well further into the product they have now.

There's been a whole series of - and I'm sure they won't disagree with this - taking PES apart and rebuilding theirs in direct comparison. And you see other things, such as the replication of players, which we're now bouncing back at with our Player ID. And there are other recent examples as well where it seems as soon as we're announcing one thing they're announcing the same thing as well. I'm not sure how that happens by accident so often.

（10）What are you saying there? Are you accusing EA of copying PES?

Jon Murphy: Yes.
I wouldn't say they are actively doing that right now. I'm saying they have a long history of copying PES to get to where they want to be. People shouldn't forget that's how they got where they are. You can give them loads of credit for how they've got to where they got to now, and you can see it as a totally valuable product in its own right that does have ideas we can all learn from, but we shouldn't forget that PES innovated all of this stuff and they did copy it.

（11）Is development set up in a way that EA can react so quickly to your announced features to have them in FIFA? Or is it just a coincidence?

Jon Murphy: I have no idea. In many cases it must be coincidental. But then you do see them reacting to what we've done last year quite naturally. For example, this year they're talking about the AI and gameplay as being a key force, which is exactly what we were dealing with last year as a key feature. That's not a coincidence, I'm sure.
I'm not going to start knocking the fact they've pushed the football genre onwards, while we were stagnating, and they've invested properly in this generation of consoles. That's really kicked them on. But it's just a bit galling at times that people throw FIFA in your face constantly, and you're thinking, well hold on, the only reason why FIFA is in the position it's in now is because of PES. And it doesn't mean to say FIFA will always occupy that position.

（12）You say EA has locked you out of official licenses. I know many people who play FIFA because of the official licenses. Is it something you will ever be able to do something about, or is that the way it's got to be forever?

Jon Murphy: I hope not. You would hope that with certain licenses the people who have them would see the advantage of pushing it out to the widest audience rather than keeping it exclusive to one product.

（13）You must be trying to convince them to do that. Why don't they?
Jon Murphy: Because at the end of the day, without going into too much detail, there are obviously a lot of existing contacts between EA and who they deal with and a lot of trust between them, and there's a lot of money changing hands, and trying to break into those situations is very hard. At the same time it should be pretty obvious that we can't compete with the massive budgets they have to throw at these things.

So, for example, with the Premier League, we've opened up negotiations with them in the past and we've got quite close to what we thought was a good offer. It went to EA exclusively. And then after that EA have been dealing directly with the clubs themselves to lock us out of individual club deals as well. So there are several layers we have to be trying to fight through.

It's something that Konami hasn't been willing to talk about in the past. I'm not sure Konami is particularly willing to talk about it right now to be honest. But I get a bit fed up with this lack of understanding about why we don't get licenses. It's not because we're lazy. It's not because we don't try and get the right licenses. It's not that we don't raise budgets to do so. Unfortunately, the reality is, EA is a massive company with large chests of money that can be brought from all kinds of IP, beyond even their FIFA brand, and we can't fight against that. So we've got to just try and be clever with what we can get out of licenses.

But people need to understand that these are the reasons at play. There just needs to be a bit more understanding when someone says to us, you're just rubbish with licenses. It's not as simple as that.

￡阿仙奴￡

慢慢看。。。~

dianzhang1983

我想翻，可惜头疼病发作。。。。
K社已经秘密准备通过新引擎制作未来实况，也就是说2013很有可能是从实况4以来老引擎版本在ps3平台上的最终作。
按照k社的说法，本次封建末代实况附加下载的dlc会超乎寻常的多，耐玩性上会做足功夫。给玩家留下难忘回忆和感动瞬间。。。
至于jon骂街ea抄袭实况，以及ea封锁授权的部分就留给热心玩家亲自解读吧。。。

j83k

基本可以看懂，但是太长了，唯有借助翻译软件吧。

dianzhang1983

我想翻，可惜头疼病发作。。。。
K社已经秘密准备通过新引擎制作未来实况，也就是说2013很有可能是从实况4以来老引擎版本在ps3平台上的最终作。
按照k社的说法，本次封建末代实况附加下载的dlc会超乎寻常的多，耐玩性上会做足功夫。给玩家留下难忘回忆和感动瞬间。。。
至于jon骂街ea抄袭实况，以及ea封锁授权的部分就留给热心玩家亲自解读吧。。。
谢谢楼主提供的信息。

小张

求高手翻译！谢了！

阳光麦田猪

慢慢看 永远期待pes&we

villa7

乔恩·墨菲已经受够了。我可以看到他的脸，当我们坐在柯纳米英国奇西克的办公室接受我们的采访。和我能感觉到他提供的所有的问题，我向他提出的每一个答案。

也许这并不奇怪。 KONAMI老牌实况足球欧洲球队的PES的鼓敲打的领导者花了几年时间，但过去很少有，他自己也承认，一直是最难堪的。 EA的FIFA系列拉走的PES - 游戏这么多，我们发挥宗教“”早在一天之前，这一代开始在黑暗的一面 - 他不得不接受第二位。一个遥远的第二位。并没有每个人都知道它。

尽管如此，他坦率地讨论了PES的“问题让我吃惊。在我们聊天墨菲解释的控制台的PES团队吾“鲈鱼”Takatsuka的冲击出口，指责国际足联的复制，指控EA的锁定了从许可证KONAMI和提供一些家庭的真理球迷的足球视频游戏流派谁，他认为，需要其头撞在一起。

公平竞争，我说。太久神秘的日本公司已解决的问题，从最近遭受的一次征服了所有的足球专营避开。 - 游戏在质量方面可能与国际足联 - 2013 AS的PE接近发布，新一代织机和系列霸主鲈鱼终于摆脱了做别的事情，也许正是我们所需要的一些侵略。

（1）我听说今年有关游戏的好东西（见马丁的PES 2013预览），现在我打，我可以看到为什么。但我知道我们的读者会说：我听说过，我为什么要相信PES是现在好多了吗？你必须看到这个反应。如何影响你的工作吗？

乔恩·墨菲：它有很多的影响，特别是对我做什么，因为我的工作是试图让球队有更深层次的连接，并与球迷，显然这并不总是容易的，因为他们在日本和很多他们不会说英语。所以有很多过滤，在这个过程中完成。

据我所知，那里的球迷，因为在过去几年中，我们已经谈到某一个方向走下去，我不认为我们已经走了下来，方向远远不够。我不认为这是必然，我们已经没有做了什么，我们已经说过。这是我们在过去没有采取足够远。这个游戏感觉像它起着不同的原因是因为我们集中我们的事情都推到合乎逻辑的结论，而不是阻碍。

出于这个原因，现在要做的是团队的设置。在团队的组织已经改变了。我们已经有了新的生产者。我们已经有了一个新的家伙称为基[增田]。这不只是他 - 有在其他位置的其他主要负责人。团队结构已经改变，和他们一起工作的方式已经改变。

此刻，我们看到终于相信，在我们的计划，并深信我们要看到通过。在过去，一个很好的例子是我们几年前带来了手动传球系统，但我们从来没有把它的阶段，这是真的完全手中。现在这个新团队愿意承担这些风险。

（2）什么引发了这种结构的重组？

乔恩·墨菲：我不会说引发是正确的方式来描述它，因为它是如此逐步。它已经在我们这一代的斗争。它已经释放了几个产品，实现了我们要去的地方没有团队希望去，但在同一时间内某些人的团队已经有很长一段时间也许真的不知道如何强制一个新的方向。

在同一时间，已经有变化以及中高层管理人员。已经有公司已经取得作为一家日本公司，我们看到作为重点开发的产品的消费者直接打交道，变化。在工作​​中已经出现了各种部队。

从我的身边，我一直在努力为消费者的门开了一段时间。这是一个渐进的过程，以及。所有这些事情都走到了一起今年的地步，我们觉得像我们回到路线上，我们很高兴。如果你跟队，这是一个路由，然后我们将继续走向未来。今年的产品，也有他们的意图与未来版本使用不同的引擎推到未来几年内，产品的关键重点。

（3）对于首次鲈鱼不再面对PE​​S的。这是为什么？

乔恩·墨菲：因为我们希望有一定的金额，以获取新的血液，通过换血队，也因为我们已经有了他，你会看到它不直接相关的PES专营权的新项目作为传统的模式。显然有很多的时间和空间留给了PES的，你会明白它像视频游戏，但我们不能只是作为视频游戏现在坐在周围的思维。谁家了，要考虑新的项目。因此，他填补这个角色。在同一时间，它给我们一个机会，一些新血的孩子，并迫使一些新的方向。

（4）决定取消部分因为与先前的PES系列游戏，也许没有远远不够的不满程度的PES鲈鱼？

乔恩·墨菲：你认为这些东西发挥我们已经取得了在该决定的一部分。这不只是这样的事情。鲈鱼，自己已经得到了一个点，在那里他也许有点沮丧，他将如何采取专营。 PES的发展开始，他是正确的。他是这么说的PES的创造者。他对足球比赛的眼光没有足球比赛的机器可以运行快速发展。他有一个视频游戏的传统观点，而不是一个视频游戏的现代观点，这是沙箱游戏，可以通过提供奖励。

我们在日本看到的，它是公平地说，很长一段时间，传统视频游戏的故事。而在美国或欧洲，我们看到了更多的自由泳方法 - 至少它给人的印象自由泳。显然不是一个沙盘游戏的沙箱游戏是 - 你的手仍在领导，但这种印象是两种文化之间的不同。

他踩着过去的原因有很多。他不下台的团队。每天他仍然参与他们正在做的一切。他是在所有PES有关项目的生产队伍。他仍然是在同一间办公室。他仍然坐在旁边的人一样。他仍然给输入走动。这不是我们引导他柯纳米。他被转移到什么都可能变成潜在的一些地方采取足球非常有趣的想法。

（5）因此，他仍然工作在PES品牌？

乔恩·墨菲：他仍然对足球工作对我们来说，可能是最简单的方式思考。不管这是不是胜利十一人或PES生产的东西，或者我们已经有了一个全新的IP，或提供游戏的新系统，不管它是什么，他仍然参与我们的足球工作室。据短期是PES的反正。所以他仍然存在，与PES。这到后来的善良变成只有天知道。但他仍然存在。

（6）如何您访问PES“目前在英国的健康还专门在欧洲更广的范围内？它是如何做？

乔恩·墨菲：它可能经历了重症监护期间，正呈现全面复苏的迹象。它有大量的吗啡在其手臂出手，这只是走出床，再次展开激战。

（7）在英国，它给人的感觉像去年国际足联拉离聚醚砜，比前几年更使。

乔恩·墨菲：您能谈谈两件事情：产品质量和产品销售。在产品销售方面，明确的EA，已经从我们马上。是公平的，如果你看看在英国的直接，我们从来没有对他们铅。我们一直对他们的产品质量领先，但我们从来没有超过他们在销售。一直有销售差距。生长在英国的销售差距。这是显而易见的。这部分原因是由于产品的质量，我们一直在改善，现在堆叠起来容易对国际足联这个版本。但它也做金钱花在市场营销上花的钱，来锁定我们的牌照。

他们所做的公关很好的说服人的差距大于它实际上是有一个一定的工作量。
（8）你什么意思？


乔恩·墨菲：舆论已经转向对PES的方式沿着这不一定出生的产品的质量最近一个已经帮助。有一段时间的产品有很好的理由表示不满 - 几年 - 我们不知道我们要去哪里。但最近的产品质量已经回来，我不认为我们已经给予应有的尊重，因为买了这么多，国际足联是更好的想法只是想法的PES买的人以同样的方式，远远超过国际足联在过去的岁月，过了好一会儿，他们得到了这种情况，因为它是如此根深蒂固。我们现在看到的对面是真实的。假设有一个自动国际足联现在是刚刚好。

例如，如果你看一下在线体验表示满意，我们得到很多投诉的人说他们不快乐，在PES的滞后和国际足联拥有完善的在线播放。我们都知道，如果你玩国际足联网上你有一个全系列的问题。我不是说我们更好的在线或他们更好的在线，但看来左右摇摆，在显微镜下把我们比他们这些天。我也认为我们没有得到足够的承认的方式，我们仍然倾向于创新，他们仍然倾向于遵循了很多，我们做什么。

（9）你能不能给我任何的例子吗？

乔恩·墨菲：如果你更深入PES的过去，你可以看到他们已经明显了一场比赛，这是由PES的完全不同，开始复制的PES开始服用领域的PES产品以及进一步现在有。

这里是一个全系列 - 我相信他们不会不同意这种说法 - 以聚醚砜除了重建他们在直接比较。和你看到其他的事情，作为球员，我们现在反弹与我们的玩家ID复制等。还有其他最近的例子，以及它似乎尽快为我们宣布一件事，他们宣布同样的事情，以及。我不知道如何，事故发生时常常。

（10）有你在说什么？你指责复制PES的EA？

乔恩·墨菲：是的。
我不会说他们正在积极做现在这种权利。我说他们有一个复制的PES去他们想去的地方，历史悠久。人们不应该忘记，是他们如何得到他们在哪里。你可以给他们如何他们已经得到了，到现在他们从哪里得到信贷的负荷，你可以看到它作为一个完全在自己的权利，确实有想法，我们都可以学习有价值的产品，但我们不应该忘记这东西，PES的创新，他们没有把它复制。

（11）是发展的方式，EA反应如此迅速地向您宣布的特点，有他们在国际足联成立吗？还是仅仅是一种巧合？

乔恩·墨菲：我不知道。在许多情况下，它必须是巧合。但是，那么你就看到他们的反应，我们所做的去年相当自然。例如，今年他们正在谈论的AI和游戏作为一个重要的力量，这正是我们去年处理的一个关键功能。这不是巧合，我敢肯定。
我不是要开始敲他们已经把足球流派起，而我们停滞不前，他们已经在这一代游戏机的正确投资。这是真的踢他们。但它只是有点擦伤倍的人扔在你的脸，国际足联不断，你在想什么，以及举行，为什么国际足联在它现在的位置是唯一的原因是因为PES的。它并不等于说，国际足联将始终占据这个位置。

（12）你说EA已经锁定了正式牌照。我知道很多人玩，因为国际足联的正式牌照。这是你将永远是能够做一些事情，或者是方式它有永远吗？

乔恩·墨菲：我希望不会。您希望与某些许可证，有他们的人会看到推到最广泛的观众，而不是保持它独有的一种产品的优势。

（13），你必须设法说服他们这样做。他们为什么不呢？
乔恩·墨菲：因为在一天结束时，没有太多的细节，有明显大量的EA和他们处理和大量的信任，他们之间现有的接触，并有1钱很多易手，并试图闯入这些情况是非常困难的。在同一时间，它应该是很明显的，我们无法与之抗衡的庞大的预算，他们不得不放弃这些东西。

因此，例如，与英超联赛中，我们已经开辟了与他们在过去的谈判，我们已经有了相当接近，我们认为是一个很好的提议。去EA的独家。再之后，EA已直接处理与俱乐部本身锁定个别俱乐部交易以及我们。因此，有几层，我们必须努力争取通过。

这件事情，Konami有没有愿意谈过去约。我不知道柯纳米是特别愿意谈论它，现在要诚实。不过，我有点厌倦这种缺乏理解为什么我们没有得到许可证。这不是因为我们懒。这不是因为我们不尝试，并得到正确的许可证。这并不是说我们不提高预算这样做。不幸的是，现实是，EA是用大量的金钱，可以带来各种知识产权，甚至他们的国际足联品牌之外，胸前巨大的公司，我们不能打击。所以，我们只是尝试，我们可以得到牌照聪明。

但是，人们需要了解，这些都是在作怪的原因。有只是需要多一点的了解，当有人对我们说，你是只是许可证垃圾。它不是那样简单

LYNYN

在线翻译着实不给力……
求英语达人现身……